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ID Category [?] Severity [?] Reproducibility Date Submitted Last Update
03105 Documentation Trivial N/A Apr 11, 2009, 19:12 Apr 16, 2009, 22:19
Tester Braille View Status Public Platform MAME (Official Binary)
Assigned To etabeta Resolution Fixed OS Windows XP/Vista 32-bit
Status [?] Resolved Driver
Version 0.130 Fixed in Version 0.131 Build Normal
Fixed in Git Commit Github Pull Request #
Summary 03105: quizmeku: Year is listed as 1994, but title screen shows 1992.
Description Title screen image shows 1992 as the game's year.
Steps To Reproduce
Additional Information
Github Commit
Flags
Regression Version
Affected Sets / Systems quizmeku
Attached Files
png file icon 0000.png (16,172 bytes) Apr 11, 2009, 19:12
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Notes
13
User avatar
No.04187
Fujix
Administrator
Apr 11, 2009, 19:44
Actual release date of the game is May 1993.
User avatar
No.04188
Haze
Senior Tester
Apr 11, 2009, 20:52
displayed copyright year of earliest (released) revision is usually used for 'year' field.. in this case, 1992.
User avatar
No.04189
Braille
Tester
Apr 11, 2009, 21:24
So, can I consider MAME´s official criteria as this copyright year? Because there are others reports I want to send in this line.
User avatar
No.04190
Tafoid
Administrator
Apr 11, 2009, 22:08
If you have a bunch, it would be better to list them at a forum (as you have been) rather than posting more bugs about them. The MAMEDev read the .info forum enough to be able to determine and add the information as you post it.

Thanks.
User avatar
No.04191
Fujix
Administrator
Apr 12, 2009, 07:48
edited on: Apr 12, 2009, 07:49
I don't mean I have any objection to the current policy of MAME.
It is just for your trivia, just suggesting the game has been "matured" in the company :)
User avatar
No.04193
Haze
Senior Tester
Apr 12, 2009, 10:41
Well afaik what I've stated has been the general policy, although there have been a few exceptions.

If a 1990 game, ends up with a 1994 revision, that wouldn't make it a 1994 game. It would be a 1994 revision of a 1990 game. However, if the year on such a set was set to 1994, and you looked at the parent roms in MAME, then it would give a scewed idea of the order in which games were made. (and in the case of many games, the title screens retain the original year, see some cps2 sets for example)

The previous policy was also that bootlegs would share the date of the original game, rather than the date (which could be false / hacked) shown on the bootleg. However, in many cases, the dates shown on the bootlegs are used.

This isn't helped by the Korean games, which in many cases are bootlegs, but are also definitely independant releases, many years later than the games from which they were hacked. Using the year of the game they were hacked from makes no sense in this case.

Like many things in MAME, the actual policy is 'use your common sense' Anything else should be treated as a guideline.
User avatar
No.04200
etabeta
Developer
Apr 13, 2009, 11:20
In this specific case, I would use the release date as mentioned in arcade books, with a note in the source specifying that the date is correct despite the title screen

It seems the more 'use your common sense'-like solution.

Any objections?
User avatar
No.04204
Haze
Senior Tester
Apr 13, 2009, 16:59
as long as the reasoning is fully explained, and you're sure there was no 1992 release, then yes.
User avatar
No.04205
Braille
Tester
Apr 13, 2009, 17:00
Gentlemen, my only request is that you define objectively this rule. The copyright way is a more technological view, wich gives a better idea of what's going on in that time (in my humble opinion, the best law). The release date is a commercial approach, based on the market. This issue may seems trivial, but you should remember that lots of games databases relys on MAME, so this is crucial for historical purposes. And notice that the gap between both approachs may be years (a life time in technology). So, wathever your decision is, make it very clear.
Thanks for the discussion!
User avatar
No.04208
etabeta
Developer
Apr 14, 2009, 08:54
I think that we should use the release date, when available and confirmed. Adding in the driver source a note about the different copyright on the title screen.

However, I'm open to suggestions (BEFORE sending a diff which changes those years ;) )
User avatar
No.04210
etabeta
Developer
Apr 15, 2009, 07:51
After thinking a bit more on this, I changed my mind. I would actually prefer the following:

* drivers should output the copyright year when present (up to the 'common sense' exceptions mentioned by haze and few others)

* release dates could go in mamedriv.c (where a lot of these informations already have been added) and, possibly (but it's up to the driver author), in comments included in the source

Since no one else came up supporting my previous position, I think I can fix a few of the mentioned issues to make year agree with the copyright at title screen, with general consensus.
User avatar
No.04212
Braille
Tester
Apr 16, 2009, 21:51
Summarizing the discussion:

Game (MAME year) -> Copyright (title screen) / Release Date (Shima Pong book)

System 16
Dynamite Dux (ddux) 1989 -> 1988 / 1988
Excite League (exctleag) 1989 -> 1988 / 1988
Sukeban Jansi Ryuko (sjryuko) 1987 -> 1988 / 1988

System 18
Bloxeed (bloxeed) 1990 -> 1989 / 1990

System 24
Quiz Rouka wo Wasuremashita 1994 -> 1991 / 1991
Quiz Mekurumeku Story 1994 -> 1992 / 1993

System 32
Arabian Fight 1992 -> 1991 / 1992
Jurassic Park 1994 -> 1993 / 1994
Rad Mobile 1991 -> 1990 / 1991
User avatar
No.04213
etabeta
Developer
Apr 16, 2009, 22:19
edited on: Apr 16, 2009, 22:19
in next version, these games will have years reflecting title screens. released dates which differ are noted in comments and in mamedriv.c